ShopMobileRadio RSSRivals.com Yahoo! Sports


Tomahawks
Register User Options
Site: Forum:


Post New topic Post New Poll Post Reply   Page 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

Previous Topic | Next Topic | Back to Topics

Originally posted by Nole Daddy:

Texas would not go to the SEC, and I would think that ICE knows that.
At present...........no chance.  But once upon a time, Florida State had no interest in leaving the ACC for the SEC.  Times change.  I doubt A&M would support voting for Florida's heated rival to be added to the conference, when they know it could be their heated rival up for a vote down the road. 

I really wish I owned a spy shop instead of a diamond import & engagement ring design company, b/c I'd just bug the SEC HQ and feed info to the board live. 

11/27 1:36 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by Micco:
The administration, including Barron and chairman Bense are not ostriches, but there is more at stake here than the football program.  Leadership was engaged last year and remain so.  
Exactly. It amazes me how many people don't believe this.
11/27 1:37 PM | IP: Logged

The traveling issue is not relevant. In our current conference, we have schools from Miami to NY. The cost of travel has quickly become cost neutral (between ACC and Big12)
11/27 1:38 PM | IP: Logged



Originally posted by 71/BORASCH/06:




Originally posted by Micco:
The administration, including Barron and chairman Bense are not ostriches, but there is more at stake here than the football program.  Leadership was engaged last year and remain so.  


Exactly. It amazes me how many people don't believe this.


Not only do they not believe it, they speak out against the administration and call them names.  Everyone's an expert on the message boards.
11/27 1:39 PM | IP: Logged

IF it is true the SEC is looking to recruit 2 new teams and you need 9 of 12 votes to be in....who is saying no outside of UF and UGA? And if it's not going to be FSU and GT they want, then who would be the better fit?

Bama
Arkansas
Aubrun
UF
UGA
Kentucky
LSU
Ole Miss
MIssissippi State
Missouri
South Carolina
Tenn
Texas A&M
Vanderbelt


This post was edited on 11/27 1:43 PM by DanC78

11/27 1:41 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by = Ice Man =:

Originally posted by Nole Daddy:

Texas would not go to the SEC, and I would think that ICE knows that.
At present...........no chance.  But once upon a time, Florida State had no interest in leaving the ACC for the SEC.  Times change.  I doubt A&M would support voting for Florida's heated rival to be added to the conference, when they know it could be their heated rival up for a vote down the road. 

I really wish I owned a spy shop instead of a diamond import & engagement ring design company, b/c I'd just bug the SEC HQ and feed info to the board live. 


Texas is in a much better position than FSU is, for many reasons but mostly money.  UT and FSU look down on the SEC for academics, but we would probably crawl through glass to get there while UT can just say no.  Wherever they are, they are in power and will be in a viable conference.

This post was edited on 11/27 1:42 PM by Nole Daddy

11/27 1:41 PM | IP: Logged



Originally posted by goldmom:






Originally posted by ChopHouse:

goldmom nailed it.





Glad I'm nailing something. At my age, there ain't much else.



 
Thank you, as always, for the great posts, often with historical context.....AND for adding some levity to a too heated discussion!
11/27 1:41 PM | IP: Logged

Be careful what you wish for.....FSU will lose 2-3 games a year in the SEC.  Guaranteed. 
11/27 1:42 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by 71/BORASCH/06:

Originally posted by Micco:
The administration, including Barron and chairman Bense are not ostriches, but there is more at stake here than the football program.  Leadership was engaged last year and remain so.  
Exactly. It amazes me how many people don't believe this.
I actually do believe this.  Which would mean that they have explored the possibility of leaving for another conference.  I just don't understand why you can be so sure they're on top of this, and so adamant that leaving isn't going to happen.

11/27 1:43 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by VANole1:

Be careful what you wish for.....FSU will lose 2-3 games a year in the SEC.  Guaranteed. 
FSU will win every game it ever plays in the SEC.

GUARANTEED.

Both of our statements are dumb.
11/27 1:44 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by VANole1:

Be careful what you wish for.....FSU will lose 2-3 games a year in the SEC.  Guaranteed. 

Some years, and some years we could win the MNC.
11/27 1:44 PM | IP: Logged
While we do get our share of top recruits, there are at least a handful we miss out on because of our conference. Kids make their decisions based on many factors...proximity to home, playing time, AND conference to name a few. Just saying that it can only get better if we affiliate with a stronger conference. No one can argue with that.
11/27 1:44 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by Nole Daddy:


Originally posted by VANole1:

Be careful what you wish for.....FSU will lose 2-3 games a year in the SEC.  Guaranteed. 

Some years, and some years we could win the MNC.

Nole Daddy - well put, as usual.
11/27 1:46 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by Dot Com:


Originally posted by AllNoles:
It's interesting that Gene has talked with Chip and compared notes, has heard from contacts at UA and others, but still we have almost nothing from within FSU. I don't say that as a shot to Gene, but to point out that however much other logic there is out there, nothing happens if our leadership sits on its hands.  And I have not seen anything in the last 5 years to suggest we will do anything but sit back and maybe react to things.  I am very worried that while there may be options out there, we won't take advantage of even looking into them.
Don't assume that because I don't specifically mention talking to an FSU source or sources that I haven't. I have spoken to a couple people tied into the program for some of this information.  And I'll add that for the first time there is legitimate talk among the decision makers that the ACC may not be in FSU's long term best interests. 

Fair enough.  I was not assuming you were not taking to anyone at FSU.  I was simply assuming that if you were, there was nothing you could report about yet.  To me, that was bad news.  Very bad news.

It's great to hear our leadership is finally at least reasliizing there is a problem.  However, it is mind boggling that it's taken this long to realize that.  That our leadership crapped on the idea of leaving, bad talked the B12 when the issues were being floated, and never apparently even reached out to find out what our options might be.  Whether looking now or not, our leadership on all this has been crappy.  Whatever FSU's long term goals last summer, there is NO excuse for not having at least been talking with the B12 and even the SEC.  Public statements like the ones we made, which did not just publicly support where we are (which I understand everyone does, even while negotiating their way out) but went so far as to set up the arguments for why we have no interest in going anywhere, served absolutely no purpose other than to further isolate FSU and limit its choices.

I hope to hear more and more about our administration actually DOING SOMETHING about this crisis rather than hear that they are always late to even realize there is a crisis. But, I have to say I am not optimistic.
11/27 1:46 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by moz9:



Originally posted by 71/BORASCH/06:




Originally posted by Micco:
The administration, including Barron and chairman Bense are not ostriches, but there is more at stake here than the football program.  Leadership was engaged last year and remain so.  


Exactly. It amazes me how many people don't believe this.


Not only do they not believe it, they speak out against the administration and call them names.  Everyone's an expert on the message boards.

Not trying to be a prick, but what exactly are these other things at stake? I hear people say academics. I say okay, please explain, and they either ignore the post or say it is too complicated to explain on a message board or something like that. I know Barron and a lot of the faculty are proud of the ACC affiliation as are a number of posters here. I just don't see what tangible benefit there is to it.

I am genuinely interested. I'd love to hear what it is.
11/27 1:47 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by ed42222:

How do you figure if FSU and GT went to the SEC, we would be in the East. It doesn't make sense, it would make more sense if we went into the west and GT went to the East. IJS
Remember that Missouri is currently slotted in the east division. If we added 2 ACC teams, Missouri would move to the west and the ACC teams would be put in the east.
11/27 1:47 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by Nole Daddy:


Originally posted by VANole1:

Be careful what you wish for.....FSU will lose 2-3 games a year in the SEC.  Guaranteed. 

Some years, and some years we could win the MNC.




And let us not forget BEFORE the four team playoff, a two loss SEC team both played for and won the national championship.
11/27 1:48 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by SavageSteve:

Originally posted by 71/BORASCH/06:

Originally posted by Micco:
The administration, including Barron and chairman Bense are not ostriches, but there is more at stake here than the football program.  Leadership was engaged last year and remain so.  
Exactly. It amazes me how many people don't believe this.
I actually do believe this.  Which would mean that they have explored the possibility of leaving for another conference.  I just don't understand why you can be so sure they're on top of this, and so adamant that leaving isn't going to happen.

I'm adamant about the SEC not happening, unfortunately. I just don't see us ever getting the votes. We would have to convince a lot of schools to change their minds. That's why at this point i'm not really sure. I'm under the impression we wouldn't do the Big 12 without several partners, and we wouldn't be accepted into the SEC. Not too many options.

Another question is this...what happens if the ACC gets Louisville? Of course there are many on here that would oppose anything the ACC does, but would that make people that count happy (Clemson, Notre Dame, GT, FSU)? If the ACC voted down West Virginia, would they really vote in Louisville? And what would Notre Dame do? I am still under the impression that Notre Dame made the deal with the ACC to eventually get in full-time, in football. Does this change that? For the better or worse?

Lots of wildcards at the moment.
11/27 1:50 PM | IP: Logged

"I trust our President and BOT to make the right decisions."

I'm not so sure I do.....Who was it who just said he doesn't really understand all the conference jumping?


"All of this conference jumping seems as if it keeps going and going," Florida State President Eric Barron said. "I don't necessarily understand it. The ACC is a fine conference, a fine conference academically and a fine conference athletically."
11/27 1:52 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by noledraper:

Hope something happens fast. Next season home games will show a lot of empty seats.
Not if we love our institution as we say we do.  I really dislike our current 
fan base.  It's always you do what I want when I want it or I won't come to games anymore.  We are much better off without fans like that.
11/27 1:52 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by dlowe01:
While we do get our share of top recruits, there are at least a handful we miss out on because of our conference. Kids make their decisions based on many factors...proximity to home, playing time, AND conference to name a few. Just saying that it can only get better if we affiliate with a stronger conference. No one can argue with that.
What if we lost two more games in a season because of tougher competition and we lost a couple of kids due to our record not being as good?  
11/27 1:53 PM | IP: Logged

If we join the SEC or BIG12 we better get use to losing 4-5 games each year. This team is soft and Not well coached on offense so the SEC will take our lunch and the BIG 12 will just outscore us. If we can't beat NC State or Florida what will happen when we are playing UF, ATM, LSU, and maybe UGA the same year. This might get ugly.
11/27 1:53 PM | IP: Logged



Originally posted by AllNoles:




Originally posted by Dot Com:





Originally posted by AllNoles:
It's interesting that Gene has talked with Chip and compared notes, has heard from contacts at UA and others, but still we have almost nothing from within FSU. I don't say that as a shot to Gene, but to point out that however much other logic there is out there, nothing happens if our leadership sits on its hands.  And I have not seen anything in the last 5 years to suggest we will do anything but sit back and maybe react to things.  I am very worried that while there may be options out there, we won't take advantage of even looking into them.


Don't assume that because I don't specifically mention talking to an FSU source or sources that I haven't. I have spoken to a couple people tied into the program for some of this information.  And I'll add that for the first time there is legitimate talk among the decision makers that the ACC may not be in FSU's long term best interests. 



Fair enough.  I was not assuming you were not taking to anyone at FSU.  I was simply assuming that if you were, there was nothing you could report about yet.  To me, that was bad news.  Very bad news.

It's great to hear our leadership is finally at least reasliizing there is a problem.  However, it is mind boggling that it's taken this long to realize that.  That our leadership crapped on the idea of leaving, bad talked the B12 when the issues were being floated, and never apparently even reached out to find out what our options might be.  Whether looking now or not, our leadership on all this has been crappy.  Whatever FSU's long term goals last summer, there is NO excuse for not having at least been talking with the B12 and even the SEC.  Public statements like the ones we made, which did not just publicly support where we are (which I understand everyone does, even while negotiating their way out) but went so far as to set up the arguments for why we have no interest in going anywhere, served absolutely no purpose other than to further isolate FSU and limit its choices.

I hope to hear more and more about our administration actually DOING SOMETHING about this crisis rather than hear that they are always late to even realize there is a crisis. But, I have to say I am not optimistic.



How do you know they havent been on top of this the entire time but kept their real move of going to SEC quiet for as long as possible?  By leaking info of move to big 12.  Disguise plan B as plan A as to not draw to much attention to plan A. Smart if you ask me not incompetant at all. We can go to the big 12 whever we want to; lets be real here. The goal is the SEC. We are an SEC football school. No 2 ways about it.
11/27 1:55 PM | IP: Logged

I believe Tech was a member of the SEC many years ago.  Left to better balance academics with athletics.  Tech is a good fit and a coverage coup for the BIG 10 if it happens.  So is BC, although you would think UVA would be very attractive as well.
11/27 1:55 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by alwaysgr8fsu:

If we join the SEC or BIG12 we better get use to losing 4-5 games each year. This team is soft and Not well coached on offense so the SEC will take our lunch and the BIG 12 will just outscore us. If we can't beat NC State or Florida what will happen when we are playing UF, ATM, LSU, and maybe UGA the same year. This might get ugly.


Do you realize Texas A&M went 6-6 in the Big 12 last year, and had a pretty easy schedule?

When did FSU fans get so afraid of decent competition and a hard schedule?
11/27 1:56 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by larryvr:
I'll take either the Big 12 or SEC.  We will be much better off either way.  Personally, I think we fight the exit fee, offer $25M and say if you want the rest, you can take us to federal court.  I'm sure the lawyer fees would add up quickly and the ACC will take what we give them.  
I suspect there's a venue clause that requires this to be litigated in NC state court.  I would be shocked if not.

That said, I still think there's a real issue with the fight.  The fact is FSU leaving would be devastating to the ACC, more so than if any other team left.  I would not be shocked at all if FSU had to admit that it would cost the ACC more than $50M over the next 12 years if FSU were to leave.

And, I suspect there's an attorney's fee provision if we lost.
11/27 1:58 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by TheBrickhouse:

Originally posted by alwaysgr8fsu:

If we join the SEC or BIG12 we better get use to losing 4-5 games each year. This team is soft and Not well coached on offense so the SEC will take our lunch and the BIG 12 will just outscore us. If we can't beat NC State or Florida what will happen when we are playing UF, ATM, LSU, and maybe UGA the same year. This might get ugly.


Do you realize Texas A&M went 6-6 in the Big 12 last year, and had a pretty easy schedule?

When did FSU fans get so afraid of decent competition and a hard schedule?

Most FSU fans don't feel like him.
11/27 1:58 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by samdingo:

Not trying to be a prick, but what exactly are these other things at stake? I hear people say academics. I say okay, please explain, and they either ignore the post or say it is too complicated to explain on a message board or something like that. I know Barron and a lot of the faculty are proud of the ACC affiliation as are a number of posters here. I just don't see what tangible benefit there is to it.

I am genuinely interested. I'd love to hear what it is.
Academic funding, the ACC has a consortium which was just started a few years ago with the eventual goal of becoming like the Big 10's. Basically the goal is to share academic research and funding. If you're associated with the Duke's of the world that could become very beneficial.

University gifting. Will changes in the athletic affiliation affect Booster gifting? Will our donors, who primarily aren't located in the midwest and are located up and down the east coast, still contribute to the program if they never have any interaction with it? Will that have a side-effect of academic gifting?

What are the positives? Increased football ticket sales? Increased donations?

It's not as simple as "we'll make X dollars more per year being in X conference because of TV money", but these are definitely things to consider.


This post was edited on 11/27 2:05 PM by 71/BORASCH/06

11/27 1:58 PM | IP: Logged
Hopefully the ACC gets dismantled so we have no other choice then to join another conference, either SEC or Big 12.  ACC is garbage. 
11/27 2:00 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by dlowe01:
While we do get our share of top recruits, there are at least a handful we miss out on because of our conference. Kids make their decisions based on many factors...proximity to home, playing time, AND conference to name a few. Just saying that it can only get better if we affiliate with a stronger conference. No one can argue with that.
This is simply NOT TRUE. We DO NOT lose out on recruits for being in the ACC.

Gene himself will back me up on this.
11/27 2:02 PM | IP: Logged

Not scared. Difference with ATM this year and last is Sumlin. He has a nice offensive scheme and not to metion one of the best young QB's in college football. If you have an ELITE QB you have a chance every game you play no matter who you play. If FSU played ATM today ATM would beat us. Our offense is avg at best when it faces a legit team. name the last team FSU looked good when the other team had talent as well????? FSU numbers on offense only look good because of the two cupcakes and the weak ACC. Imagine us playing the offense we play playing the teams I talked about. UF ran down our throats so I'm guessing UGA, ATM, LSU, and Bama wouldn't have any problems scoring on us also. We need to make major changes before you join the BIG BOY league. Ask Missouri how good the SEC is. Would it be any fun joining a conference just to have more money but go 8-4 or 7-5 most years?
11/27 2:02 PM | IP: Logged
Thanks ice!

So not to put you on the spot but can you please guesstimate FSU 's chances of being in the following conferences in the year 2015:

SEC?
ACC?
Big 12?

Thanks a bunch man!
11/27 2:02 PM | IP: Logged
So is Texas willing to go to, or revise Big 12 economics to, share revenue equitably?

I don't see them doing this, so a move to the SEC seems unlikely because Alabama, LSU and most others are not going to go for something like TLN, allowing them an advantage.
11/27 2:03 PM | IP: Logged
We all witnessed on saturday why we need
To be in the ACC
11/27 2:04 PM | IP: Logged



Originally posted by AllNoles:




Originally posted by larryvr:
I'll take either the Big 12 or SEC.  We will be much better off either way.  Personally, I think we fight the exit fee, offer $25M and say if you want the rest, you can take us to federal court.  I'm sure the lawyer fees would add up quickly and the ACC will take what we give them.  


I suspect there's a venue clause that requires this to be litigated in NC state court.  I would be shocked if not.

That said, I still think there's a real issue with the fight.  The fact is FSU leaving would be devastating to the ACC, more so than if any other team left.  I would not be shocked at all if FSU had to admit that it would cost the ACC more than $50M over the next 12 years if FSU were to leave.

And, I suspect there's an attorney's fee provision if we lost.


I suspect that FSU can't be strong armed into paying an exit fee it voted against (especially if it chooses to leave quickly), I also suspect that if in fact it's determined that FSU in indeed worth what the ACC says, some judge would listen to a counter claim in seeking revenue commenserate with this perceived value brought to the league.

This post was edited on 11/27 2:10 PM by erock4129

11/27 2:06 PM | IP: Logged
Borasch...you talk alot about votes. Are you telling us that you KNOW what the votes were in the SEC regarding FSU? 

How would you know if the vote was never cast?

Enlighten us with your wisdom as to what SEC schools were in favor of FSU and those who weren't.

The problem with coming on a message board acting like  a know it all, is that people are going to call you out on it, and if you dont back up your talk you just look like a message board playstation all american that talks a bunch of ish.

11/27 2:07 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by Micco:
The administration, including Barron and chairman Bense are not ostriches, but there is more at stake here than the football program.  Leadership was engaged last year and remain so.  
They can be engaged while leaving options open, and without making things worse publicly.

The public spat between our BoT and admin last year was brutal to watch.  Embarassing, even.
11/27 2:07 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by sflanoleman:

I'd be happy with the Big 12. You'd have teams like Oklahoma, Ok. State, K. State, Texas, Baylor, T-Tech, West Virginia, FSU, and Clemson. That's a strong conference to me. I'd love to see us there if the SEC doesn't work out. We certainly will no longer be penalized with a conference schedule including many of those opponents.
agree with the slate..   hate the travel costs for the teams and the fans..

11/27 2:10 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by 71/BORASCH/06:

Originally posted by samdingo:

Not trying to be a prick, but what exactly are these other things at stake? I hear people say academics. I say okay, please explain, and they either ignore the post or say it is too complicated to explain on a message board or something like that. I know Barron and a lot of the faculty are proud of the ACC affiliation as are a number of posters here. I just don't see what tangible benefit there is to it.

I am genuinely interested. I'd love to hear what it is.
Academic funding, the ACC has a consortium which was just started a few years ago with the eventual goal of becoming like the Big 10's. Basically the goal is to share academic research and funding. If you're associated with the Duke's of the world that become very beneficial.

University gifting. Will changes in the athletic affiliation affect Booster gifting? Will our donors, who primarily aren't located in the midwest and are located up and down the east coast, still contribute to the program if they never have any interaction with it? Will that have a side-effect of academic gifting?

What are the positives? Increased football ticket sales? Increased donations?

It's not as simple as "we'll make X dollars more per year being in X conference because of TV money", but these are definitely things to consider.
Sorry, I was speaking more to the SEC than the Big XII which in that circumstance it's a no brainer to me, but the SEC does have a similar arrangement... and it only took the ACC 20 years to get this one going. 
11/27 2:13 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by PANolefan:
We all witnessed on saturday why we need
To be in the ACC
Huh.

What I saw Saturday was exactly why we need to get the eff out of the ACC.
11/27 2:13 PM | IP: Logged

Joining the SEC will give us plenty of weekends like this last one. Some team running right down our throats. UT as bead as they were beat NC State with little problem and we scored 16 points. People lets get real here. FSU will struggle in the SEC with the current staff in place.
11/27 2:16 PM | IP: Logged
Found a diamond in the ruff.


Meangin what was said about the chatter amoung the FSU decision makers.

This post was edited on 11/27 2:38 PM by BiminiBound

11/27 2:16 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by alwaysgr8fsu:

If we join the SEC or BIG12 we better get use to losing 4-5 games each year. This team is soft and Not well coached on offense so the SEC will take our lunch and the BIG 12 will just outscore us. If we can't beat NC State or Florida what will happen when we are playing UF, ATM, LSU, and maybe UGA the same year. This might get ugly.


So your opinion is that FSU, based on this season is the same as it will be over the next.......say.....40 years or so?
There is no way that this program could improve?  Not through Jimbo improving?  Not through coaching changes?  Not through talent upgrades?  Nothing could make us better.  Ever again?

That seems like a valid opinion.


11/27 2:17 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by alwaysgr8fsu:

Joining the SEC will give us plenty of weekends like this last one. Some team running right down our throats. UT as bead as they were beat NC State with little problem and we scored 16 points. People lets get real here. FSU will struggle in the SEC with the current staff in place.
Well, looks like about 1/3 to 1/2 of the current staff will be heading to the Blue Grass state.

So, you'll get your wish.

FWIW, I agree we need some vitality in our coaching staff. Schemes, play calling, and mental preparedness seem stale.
11/27 2:18 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by SavageSteve:


Originally posted by alwaysgr8fsu:

If we join the SEC or BIG12 we better get use to losing 4-5 games each year. This team is soft and Not well coached on offense so the SEC will take our lunch and the BIG 12 will just outscore us. If we can't beat NC State or Florida what will happen when we are playing UF, ATM, LSU, and maybe UGA the same year. This might get ugly.


So your opinion is that FSU, based on this season is the same as it will be over the next.......say.....40 years or so?
There is no way that this program could improve?  Not through Jimbo improving?  Not through coaching changes?  Not through talent upgrades?  Nothing could make us better.  Ever again?

That seems like a valid opinion.



He's just a self hating Seminole, if he actually is a Seminole.  
11/27 2:20 PM | IP: Logged


Originally posted by alwaysgr8fsu:

Not scared. Difference with ATM this year and last is Sumlin. He has a nice offensive scheme and not to metion one of the best young QB's in college football. If you have an ELITE QB you have a chance every game you play no matter who you play. If FSU played ATM today ATM would beat us. Our offense is avg at best when it faces a legit team. name the last team FSU looked good when the other team had talent as well????? FSU numbers on offense only look good because of the two cupcakes and the weak ACC. Imagine us playing the offense we play playing the teams I talked about. UF ran down our throats so I'm guessing UGA, ATM, LSU, and Bama wouldn't have any problems scoring on us also. We need to make major changes before you join the BIG BOY league. Ask Missouri how good the SEC is. Would it be any fun joining a conference just to have more money but go 8-4 or 7-5 most years?
I like that it's possible that Tamu can turn the corner in one year, due to one player who is a freshman but FSU will remain at the same level for the rest of history.
11/27 2:21 PM | IP: Logged

Originally posted by erock4129:





Originally posted by AllNoles:







Originally posted by larryvr:
I'll take either the Big 12 or SEC.  We will be much better off either way.  Personally, I think we fight the exit fee, offer $25M and say if you want the rest, you can take us to federal court.  I'm sure the lawyer fees would add up quickly and the ACC will take what we give them.  




I suspect there's a venue clause that requires this to be litigated in NC state court.  I would be shocked if not.

That said, I still think there's a real issue with the fight.  The fact is FSU leaving would be devastating to the ACC, more so than if any other team left.  I would not be shocked at all if FSU had to admit that it would cost the ACC more than $50M over the next 12 years if FSU were to leave.

And, I suspect there's an attorney's fee provision if we lost.




I suspect that FSU can't be strong armed into paying an exit fee it voted against (especially if it chooses to leave quickly), I also suspect that if in fact it's determined that FSU in indeed worth what the ACC says, some judge would listen to a counter claim in seeking revenue commenserate with this perceived value brought to the league.

This post was edited on 11/27 2:10 PM by erock4129


With all due respect, I suspect you don't understand contract law.  "I made a bad deal" is not a viable counterclaim, and no judge in the world could even consider your "commensurate revenue" argument.  If FSU did not like the deal, the revenue split, it should not have signed off.  It did.  Part of contract law is that a party is entitled to make a bad deal, and courts don't "fix" those deals later.

The buyout issue rises or falls on its own merits.  While the "objection" issue might come up, it depends on the league bylaws.  If we signed on to a set of bylaws that allows the majority to change a buyout number, it's a lot harder to complain. 

And, my biggest issue is that the usual remedy for striking a buyout is that the other party just gets to seek damages.  I don't understand how folks don't understand how bad that would be for FSU.  If FSU leaving, and ESPN renegotiating, only cost $1M per team (and I bet it would be more), 13M/year over 12 years is a ton of money.
11/27 2:30 PM | IP: Logged

You didn't read my post clearly. ATM turned things around with a coaching change (Sumlin). Do you see Jimbo going anywhere anytime soon? Better question, If Jimbo hires an OC who do you think he would hire? It would be someone who ran the same type of offense Jimbo runs currently. That's not improving if that's the road we take. FSU can improve but the other teams in the SEC will also. We are behind 4-5 teams right now in the SEC. Do you see us improving enough to overtake them all? FSU has been slumping for 12 years and this was suppose to be our year. 10-2 with this crap schedule would be 7-5 or 8-4 this year in the SEC. If we played UF schedule this year we are 8-4 at best. ATM, UGA, LSU, USCe, and UF on the same schedule would equal 4 losses. Is 8-4 ok just because we in the SEC?
11/27 2:38 PM | IP: Logged



Originally posted by AllNoles:




Originally posted by erock4129:








Originally posted by AllNoles:










Originally posted by larryvr:
I'll take either the Big 12 or SEC.  We will be much better off either way.  Personally, I think we fight the exit fee, offer $25M and say if you want the rest, you can take us to federal court.  I'm sure the lawyer fees would add up quickly and the ACC will take what we give them.  






I suspect there's a venue clause that requires this to be litigated in NC state court.  I would be shocked if not.

That said, I still think there's a real issue with the fight.  The fact is FSU leaving would be devastating to the ACC, more so than if any other team left.  I would not be shocked at all if FSU had to admit that it would cost the ACC more than $50M over the next 12 years if FSU were to leave.

And, I suspect there's an attorney's fee provision if we lost.






I suspect that FSU can't be strong armed into paying an exit fee it voted against (especially if it chooses to leave quickly), I also suspect that if in fact it's determined that FSU in indeed worth what the ACC says, some judge would listen to a counter claim in seeking revenue commenserate with this perceived value brought to the league.

This post was edited on 11/27 2:10 PM by erock4129




With all due respect, I suspect you don't understand contract law.  "I made a bad deal" is not a viable counterclaim, and no judge in the world could even consider your "commensurate revenue" argument.  If FSU did not like the deal, the revenue split, it should not have signed off.  It did.  Part of contract law is that a party is entitled to make a bad deal, and courts don't "fix" those deals later.

The buyout issue rises or falls on its own merits.  While the "objection" issue might come up, it depends on the league bylaws.  If we signed on to a set of bylaws that allows the majority to change a buyout number, it's a lot harder to complain. 

And, my biggest issue is that the usual remedy for striking a buyout is that the other party just gets to seek damages.  I don't understand how folks don't understand how bad that would be for FSU.  If FSU leaving, and ESPN renegotiating, only cost $1M per team (and I bet it would be more), 13M/year over 12 years is a ton of money.


So, does this speak to the incompetence of FSU leadership and their inability of getting the school's value out of the contract to begin with?

This post was edited on 11/27 2:40 PM by erock4129

11/27 2:39 PM | IP: Logged
I believe it does in part, but the problem is more systematic than that.

When FSU joined up, basketball drove a lot of value.  The ACC teams all agreed this was an equal share conference.  We have seen the issues with UTexas and the Big12.  The simple fact is that any team that is getting less revenue will always believe it is not being treated fairly and say the league should be socialist.  It's part of life.  And, given most leagues are run that way, it's hard to take another position.

The real problem is that the league overall was not managed in a way to keep overall average value competitive with other leagues.  Thus, the only way for FSU to be competitive with other leagues/teams is to demand the ACC share revenue unequally.  It has the economic argument on its side.  No one can debate FSU brings the most revenue to the league.  However, it has history and tradition running strongly against taking that position. Clearly, the administration has stuck with history and tradition, and I can't really blame them.  We can throw around the idea of unequal revenue sharing on a message board pretty easily, but few think about the long term damage that does to a league.

FSU's only real option in the last few years was to realize that being in an equal revenue league paying tons less than other leagues over the long run is not feasible, and therefore not get tied into long term contracts.  To me, that's where we failed.  I think FSU should have been aggressively seeking a better place to land, and use that leverage to make a deal with the league that did not tie us into a contract for so long with such a bad penalty for leaving.  But, once we agreed with the others to a 12 year deal, we became locked into the damages we would cause by breaching that contract.
11/27 2:48 PM | IP: Logged
Previous Topic | Next Topic | Back to Topics

Post New topic Post New Poll Post Reply Page 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

LATEST NEWS




Rivals.com is your source for: College Football | Football Recruiting | College Basketball | Basketball Recruiting | College Baseball | High School | College Merchandise
Site-specific editorial/photos Warchant.com. All rights reserved. This website is an officially and independently operated source of news and information not affiliated with any school or team.
About | Advertise with Us | Contact | Privacy Policy | About our Ads | Terms of Service | Copyright/IP policy | Yahoo! Sports - NBC Sports Network

Statistical information 2007 STATS LLC All Rights Reserved.